Otherworldy summoning.

[Mahtavatar]

Something caught my eye. CONSOLE COMMANDS. I assure you, I will run off at a random direction after this but let me ask you first, how do I SPAWN random junk? I saw this other day some epic clothing on this one lady standing around Sevenkeeps. And I would like TO HAVE THAT! Is it possible?

[Mahtavatar]

Err... anyone there?

[Lornik]

Well, you won't be able to do this via console command, especially not in Shadow Wars, where most console commands are deactivated (working only with Dragon Storm installed).

Almost all things normal citizens are wearing is somehow available in the game itself. To be bought at merchants or to be found as a questitem or loot.

It might be, that artmoney-item-hack is also available in Shadow wars, but the mechanism working in Spellforce 1 is not in Spellforce 2.

So long

Lornik

[Mahtavatar]

Yeah, well as you remember I have the GOLD EDITION. If I got you right there, it should work when Dragon Storm is installed, so I can't see any problem here? Or if I did not get you right, then I need this artmoney thingy and make things awfully complicated again...

[Free Flinker]

He's saying that as far as we know it's not possible to add items via a console command but if you want to know what's possible, or test for yourself, then this thread is as good a place to start as any. Scroll down to datura00's posts detailing commands known to work and list of other possible commands.

As for artmoney editing, you'd have to look into that yourself, though the thread I linked might help you out on that score too - also check pages 1 and 3 for comment. Just don't get your hopes up that what you want to do is possible, or worth it if it is.

[Lornik]

Well, even if console commands are working (as in your case), you won't be able to cheat items into your inventory by console command.

As for the artmoney-thing see my post above.

So long

Lornik

/oh heavens FF - I have been too slow

[Free Flinker]

If you used the proper tools, you'd know in advance what people will say It's been a while but I'm pretty sure you have one of these already...

[Mahtavatar]

There are quite alot of things that I hate, and one of those things are games that you can't MESS WITH! Seriously, have you ever played The Elder Scrolls games or Fallout ones? THOSE are a good examples of games that you can take all out of, and push them to the LIMIT, LITERALLY! Oh well... maybe I should just forget about it and go and eat a cheesburger.

Oh yes, I also hate cheeky bastards. Not really, quite a one myself.

[Free Flinker]

Originally Posted by Mahtavatar

There are quite alot of things that I hate, and one of those things are games that you can't MESS WITH! Seriously, have you ever played The Elder Scrolls games or Fallout ones? THOSE are a good examples of games that you can take all out of, and push them to the LIMIT, LITERALLY! Oh well... maybe I should just forget about it and go and eat a cheesburger.

Oh yes, I also hate cheeky bastards. Not really, quite a one myself.

I've played both series, maybe Lornik has too, but then we're not in the buisness of designing games, we just play them OTOH, I know you're aware that this game has an editor. Since that can be used to design whole maps from the ground up I'm not really sure what you're asking for.

A Fallout 3 style ability to enter hex codes and get items out of the console maybe? Pretty cheesy to say the least but each to their own /shrug. I think I'll recommend a cheeseburger though, had one myself this evening

[Mahtavatar]

Oh no, nonono! I did not mean that I play games spawning the best weapons and armor at the start and then laugh at the faces of my enemies while whacking them to pieces at the easiest difficulty level possible. NO! That would take all the fun out of it.. What I mean is, have you see ever seen a very cool and sexy looking piece of weapon or, or hot and awesome clothing that you WANT TO HAVE but you know that it is "non-playable" and only used to decorate a NPC? I bet you have!
That is where the console of Fallout or Elder Scrolls is coming handy! You can summon the robes of the emperor out of nowhere and walk the streets of Imperial City like you own it or materialise the cut-content BETA TESLA CANNON in your hands just to get that feeling.. ahhh... I have something that I shouldn't have. That gives the game so much more replay value and it is fun and even hysterical if you use some hilarious actions at scripted events.

I don't use the console to make the game easier, I always play the game first taking it way too seriously and then after the sweet sweet story I use different methods to, as I always say, MESS the game UP! Just for the fun of it.


Oh yes, here is that armor I was longing for. Is it obtainable somewhere or is it just on her?

Mystery Armor.png

[Free Flinker]

I'm afraid that I'm a bit of a Philestine when it comes to gaming eye candy of any kind. It's the gameplay that makes or breaks a game for me and while I like a good story, once you know it there's no aid to replay value there.

Having a console in a game is, in many respects, bad enough but the danger with implementing such things as item drops into it is that it will be used, and for many reasons other than the one you give. Fair enough, that's an individual's choice, affecting no one but themselves when it's a SP game, but the fact remains that it isn't part and parcel of the spirit of a particular game. That means that developers are not obliged to provide it, though many of those who demand such things (and I get that you are doing your best to not come accross as one of them) aren't interested in the game as is but in shortcuts to the end. I don't really understand that attitude myself, though I suspect it has something to do with instant gratification, whatever that means. Perhaps it's because I detest console (the hardware platform in this case) games, with their endless repetition to get a bit right, ie those games being designed to drive you nuts, eventually, unless you can perfect your technique to pass the next point, and the next, and so on; this type of game almost begs a player to cheat their way past a sticking point. I suppose it's a habit that some gamers have been led into, so that they demand the ability to do this even when it's unnecessary - it's how they've been trained to 'play'.

Have I ever used an in-game console myself (the software variety this time)? Sure, right before I put a game away forever (apart from SF1, where it was a good idea for me to know the answers to certain questions, but that was research, not use), on account of that spelling the end of gameplay as intended. I've even made the mistake of using such things before I'm done with a game and afterwards I am done. It spoils a game for me and while one might say that if I'm done I might as well have some fun with it, I can't say it bothers me when that's not possible. Done is done, right, however you get there. Well, I might as well burn-out on it as intended, gameplay-wise. Then it's only a matter of hoping for a sequel, if it's good enough, or the next game to strike my eye.

Anyways, the thing with a game like SF2 is that not every bit of eye-candy is coded in such as way as to be useable by a player. I have no idea if that applies to your favoured piece there but it would not suprise me to discover that it did. In this respect, even if you could use it there are likely no stats associated with it so cheating it's not, if you somehow got it. But that's my musings turned on their head, by figuring that from a dev pov what would be the point of enabling such a console command. Just so a few aesthetically minded individuals can try it out? Seems like a waste of resources to me. Since the console is itself a dev tool, which only coincidentally can be used to 'cheat' if left accessible, one might ask why would a dev need such a thing in the first place? If they don't need it then, providing they planned ahead enough to know they wouldn't need it, it won't be programmed into their console.

I guess the point I'm waffling towards is that it would be better to ask for more attractive/varied equipment as standard, rather than a means of getting what you aren't supposed to have. There will still be those who don't want to wait on random drops or questing for such things but at least you'd distinguish what you want from what they want far more easily, and perhaps get a few more voices behind you too.

Meanwhile, who knows if it's possible or whether that outfit is playable or not but maybe you should post that pic on the editing board and see if there are any ideas. I dare say it'll be a lot more work but you never know, someone planning a next project might find a way of implementing that skin on a playable character, or something. OTOH, we're not exactly as lively around here as we used to be but things might change, or you might even inspire someone to give it a shot.

[Mahtavatar]

I do get your point.

For me it looks like you are one of those hardcore gamers that take the games they play so seriously that they wouldn't even THINK about modding them into something that is not lore friendly or does not fall into the canon of the universe of the game. These hardcore gamers are called "Overgamers" as for their need for even the smallest things to be correct before playing, like their position in the chair they are sitting on, or the lightning in the room.

I know what I'm saying. I have been one in my short past.

That kind of gaming is so monotonous! You make yourself the slave of the will of the developers! why do you have to do it the way it was MEANT TO BE?! Do you do that in real life too? "I eat this bread because it was meant to be eaten by me".. SERIOUSLY, people that go by the rules in real life OR GAMES are usually the dullest personalities alive.

As I told you I usually finish the game before messing around with it. USING CONSOLE COMMANDS OR CHEATS after the official run through of the game IS NOT CONSIDERED CHEATING! And you keep referring the (software) console as a cheating engine as it is only a mere devs' debug tool! Why should they leave such a feature into the game? WHY SHOULDN'T THEY? Me, and I bet quite a lot of other players like their games with some option to debug them, mod them, test the game engine to its limits and EXPERIMENT WITH THEM! Even one of the TES IV: Oblivion devoloper said in one of his interview for the PCG magazine that "We don't mind if people experiment with our game, actually we encourage it" (Probably not the exact words but you get my meaning).

I usually only buy sanbox type games, where the player has some sort of limitless freedom. I HATE tube games, that have EVERYTHING possible scripted in them, leaving no option for PERSONAL CHOICES OR RANDOMNESS! Well, regardless of the hate of tube games, suprisingly, my favourite piece of game is Metal Gear Solid, wich isn't implemented with a feature such as a console. The game is quite much unmoddable too. So that's for that.

Maybe I should ask around, or then again not. Maybe it isn't worth the fuss. I have other games to attend to as I just finished SpellForce 2. It is a good game. It is a very varied game, cantaining almost all notable things from the history of rolaplaying.

My next target?

Probably some... sci-fi game.

[Free Flinker]

Originally Posted by Mahtavatar

I do get your point.

For me it looks like you are one of those hardcore gamers that take the games they play so seriously that they wouldn't even THINK about modding them into something that is not lore friendly or does not fall into the canon of the universe of the game. These hardcore gamers are called "Overgamers" as for their need for even the smallest things to be correct before playing, like their position in the chair they are sitting on, or the lightning in the room.

I know what I'm saying. I have been one in my short past.

That kind of gaming is so monotonous! You make yourself the slave of the will of the developers! why do you have to do it the way it was MEANT TO BE?! Do you do that in real life too? "I eat this bread because it was meant to be eaten by me".. SERIOUSLY, people that go by the rules in real life OR GAMES are usually the dullest personalities alive.

LOL.

Me, an "overgamer" or even hardcore? I'm not sure how you got there from my stating the obvious, that poking things into the game via a console command is not 'in the spirit' of that game. If it were then I can think of nothing more monotonous than typing in console commands, as a game.

Hmm, thinking about it, that'd be similar to what adventure games used to be - typing in commands to a console. The only adventure was that the devs wouldn't tell you what those commands were so you had to have a thesaurus handy just to play, when it might suprise you just how many ways to say the same thing there are in the English language, probably in any language. An enter-a-console-command game wouldn't even have that measure of mystery, annoying as it was, and at least old style adventure games had a plot. You know why you don't see such games anymore? Because they can tell much more with moving pictures and allow you much more freedom of interraction with an advanced interface.

One thing though, a slave to the will of the devs? Hehe I like that. Nice use of evocative language but, basically, if you aren't playing the game as designed then you aren't playing the game. You're either cheating it or opting for a variation that isn't the game you started with. Since the basics are usually hard coded into an engine it's probably the former when it comes to computer games and let's face it, use of console commands is definately cheating. The very nature of a game is that it is bound within a ruleset when even free-for-all games have some rules.

So anyway, let me get this straight. Playing the game as designed is bad, something to be scorned, but playing the game with console commands enabled is OK? Hmm, how did that console get in there then, and who made it? The cheat fairies? Ah, that's right, it was the devs. You know, those people whose will you refuse to be a slave to. And yet... they must, I can only assume by virtue of it being you that's asking, be slave to your every whim, or get accused of making crap games. You have a very weird view of gaming, if you don't mind me saying so.

As I told you I usually finish the game before messing around with it. USING CONSOLE COMMANDS OR CHEATS after the official run through of the game IS NOT CONSIDERED CHEATING! And you keep referring the (software) console as a cheating engine as it is only a mere devs' debug tool! Why should they leave such a feature into the game? WHY SHOULDN'T THEY? Me, and I bet quite a lot of other players like their games with some option to debug them, mod them, test the game engine to its limits and EXPERIMENT WITH THEM! Even one of the TES IV: Oblivion devoloper said in one of his interview for the PCG magazine that "We don't mind if people experiment with our game, actually we encourage it" (Probably not the exact words but you get my meaning).

Slow down there. You realise that you don't get to define something which is so obviously cheating as not cheating just because you are done playing as designed. Or perhaps you'd care to elaborate on exactly who doesn't consider it as such? Just be aware that an appeal to the masses is not a valid argument.

As I said before, to each their own, but let's call it what it is, k?

I usually only buy sanbox type games, where the player has some sort of limitless freedom. I HATE tube games, that have EVERYTHING possible scripted in them, leaving no option for PERSONAL CHOICES OR RANDOMNESS! Well, regardless of the hate of tube games, suprisingly, my favourite piece of game is Metal Gear Solid, wich isn't implemented with a feature such as a console. The game is quite much unmoddable too. So that's for that.

Which just goes to show that generalising isn't always a good idea

Maybe I should ask around, or then again not. Maybe it isn't worth the fuss. I have other games to attend to as I just finished SpellForce 2. It is a good game. It is a very varied game, cantaining almost all notable things from the history of rolaplaying.

My next target?

Probably some... sci-fi game.

It's up to you whether you ask around or not, just offering a possible option.

I can recommend a game called Borderlands btw. It's a sandbox, though it does have a series of set quests too. Certainly kills the odd 20 mins here and there, which in my busy hardcore gaming schedule is usually all I can manage, sometimes in several days And then there is the imminent arrival of Faith in Destiny, if you want more SF2 to play.

[Mahtavatar]

Hehe. Maybe "hardcore" was too much, but you still show some characteristics of an overgamer. Not really accepting the fact that there IS other ways of playing games, and thinking that cheating is a death sin... *sigh* just to point out.. games are just, well, games, you hear?

See, CHOICE! It is what defines us! If I choose to play a game the way it was NOT meant to be played, exploiting cut goods, testing how things work and making those NPC's look a little better, it means i will be a MODDER or a GAME DEVELOPER..
Or then I will be robbing banks, getting things that I shouldn't have. Or then I will uncover a CONSPRACY just because I stepped out of the line and did things my way.

You, on the other hand, play games the way they are meant to be played and rooting all possibilities of cheating or glitch abusing out of them, so you might be working for the FBI someday or something.. or creating some MISSILE countermeasures in the military. Or then you will arrest me from robbing that bank, eh?

We are humans after all.. everyone has their own knick knacks, and I think you understand that.

Even in science, usually the biggest and most MINDBLOWING inventions are stumbled upon ACCIDENTALLY, when someone let their imagination FLY! Just because no one has ever said that "cheating after the official run through is not cheating", I can not say it, and create a new point of view or even... A NEW RULE! So, I CAN define something that is not defined before or, not enough to be a public "rule".

And as it is, the PEOPLE are supposed to question the government and its ways, not the other way around. Games are made based on the opinion of the crowd. If people do not like something, there is no use of making that particular thing . No one will buy it and the company does not get its MONEY! Yes MONEY. It is all about the cash. So in that case YES! The Developers are the slaves of people and not the other way around!! And NO! It's not a weird view on gaming.

I am a realist after all..

Yes! I know Borderlands. Never really considered of buying it, because it didn't look like such an epic game, but I might give it a second thought.

[Free Flinker]

Originally Posted by Mahtavatar

Hehe. Maybe "hardcore" was too much, but you still show some characteristics of an overgamer. Not really accepting the fact that there IS other ways of playing games, and thinking that cheating is a death sin... *sigh* just to point out.. games are just, well, games, you hear?

Assumption, much

I couldn't care less who cheats and who doesn't in a SP game, as I already pointed out before you began assuming, and the only thing that bothers me about it in general, hence I don't play them, are games where cheating past a certain point is almost expected, providing your average human being wants to keep their sanity. I would not describe those games as so boring they're like watching paint dry, nope... they're like like watching paint dry on your eyeballs, paint you happened to put there yourself, again and again and again, if the developers had their way.

See, CHOICE! It is what defines us! If I choose to play a game the way it was NOT meant to be played, exploiting cut goods, testing how things work and making those NPC's look a little better, it means i will be a MODDER or a GAME DEVELOPER..
Or then I will be robbing banks, getting things that I shouldn't have. Or then I will uncover a CONSPRACY just because I stepped out of the line and did things my way.

You, on the other hand, play games the way they are meant to be played and rooting all possibilities of cheating or glitch abusing out of them, so you might be working for the FBI someday or something.. or creating some MISSILE countermeasures in the military. Or then you will arrest me from robbing that bank, eh?

We are humans after all.. everyone has their own knick knacks, and I think you understand that.

Implication, much Ah well, tempting as it is to draw an analogy between cheating and crime, after all it's the done thing in net-land, apparently, I think you'll find that on this occasion I did no such thing.

Even in science, usually the biggest and most MINDBLOWING inventions are stumbled upon ACCIDENTALLY, when someone let their imagination FLY! Just because no one has ever said that "cheating after the official run through is not cheating", I can not say it, and create a new point of view or even... A NEW RULE! So, I CAN define something that is not defined before or, not enough to be a public "rule".

Um, 'flying' imaginations implies intent. If it was an accident then I think you'll find that imagination was precluded.

But to slip back into some semblance of context for a moment, you were not inventing or being scientific. You simply made an unsupported statement that, with a small measure of observation, can be easily noted as such and quashed. That's because cheating after playing the game without cheating is still cheating. You did not claim it was an undefined concept, you originally claimed just the opposite in fact, but even if no one had defined it previously then perhaps that's because it goes without saying, that cheating is cheating, irrespective of when or after what you do it. And to make it clear, I have no problem with the cheating part, only with your attempt to claim it wasn't.

And as it is, the PEOPLE are supposed to question the government and its ways, not the other way around. Games are made based on the opinion of the crowd. If people do not like something, there is no use of making that particular thing . No one will buy it and the company does not get its MONEY! Yes MONEY. It is all about the cash. So in that case YES! The Developers are the slaves of people and not the other way around!! And NO! It's not a weird view on gaming.

I am a realist after all..

You seem to be under the mistaken impression that game development is a democracy and that the way democracies work is that any vote for an idea automatically gets the green light.

The only vote you get is with your wallet but, just like you don't get to vote on how to perform brain surgery or which components to include when building a space shuttle, you don't get to vote on how to build a game. You may express a preference, it won't kill anyone, but that's as far as it goes and is usually one amoung many.

Sometimes this works, sometimes it doesn't, depends on a number of factors. Re-enabling the console, for example, happened in DS after players asked for it. OTOH, getting them to invent a new console command from scratch just because one person asked for it is probably too tall an order. When you go on to tell them what they should have included originally it makes no sense whatsoever, both from the perspective that it's too late and simply because you have provided no credentials to even suggest that you might be an expert on game design they need to listen too.

So yes, it is a rather weird view of gaming you have there. That it intersects with, or stems from, your view of life, the universe and everything, as you seem to be analogizing your way into saying it does, then it's no less weird.

Yes! I know Borderlands. Never really considered of buying it, because it didn't look like such an epic game, but I might give it a second thought.

Don't buy the hype about endless weapon generation. Endless variety of a certain weapon type maybe, small variation at that and even occasion when two identical weapons spawn. You'll eventually find a weapon/weapon set you stick with so all the rest become fluff anyway. If you just want a fun 1st person shooter though, one where you can play in their sandbox or do the odd quest, complete with character development, then it's a decent game. I usually barf playing FPS games so I tend to avoid them but even with head bobbing I can stomach this one.

[Mahtavatar]

Hrmph...

I agree with you about these over challenging games that makes you want to throw something at the nearest person passing by, when you still FAIL after 37 tries. I never liked those games. ME thinks games are meant to be entertaining and FUN, not cryptic brainbreakers so to say.

That science thing was just a reference. What I meant was that if you always have such a "conservative" view on things, you never create anything new. It does not mean that if you assume that "something goes without saying" it really does that. I think you see where I am getting here. Let me give you an example: There is this piece of land, let's say an island. No one knows if it is owned by someone. Easily enough, I move in with my troops and occupy it. Even if there is someone living there, this one guy, he is easily disposed of. One can outnumber one by willpower, strength or sheer brutality. The island is mine and the word starts spreading that there is a new government on the island that this one guy used to live on. From there poeple either cope with the situation or not.

The same goes with these unwritten rules. I can say it goes like this! Not the other way! It's word against word. That's the proplem with unwritten rules. AND when I actually get enough people to agree with my point of view, I "write" the new rule, and VOILA! I have created the official rule "cheating is not cheating when no one can see it or when done unofficially". PERIOD.

Anyone can claim power over something, if determined enough.

And again, I never said game development is like democracy. It just resembles it. This was another reference taken to the extreme. No one makes games that the people does not like. THAT would be a waste of resources. Action movies are made because majority like CAR CHASES. Smaller cars are made every day because it has been noted that PEOPLE want smaller cars that do not consume so much gas. LAWS are changed because PEOPLE are going to RIOT if they do not get what they want. PEOPLE rule this world. HUMANS! and humans have will. THE OPINION OF THE MAJORITY COUNTS! I did not say we decide how to build the game, just what we want from our games, and we want MORE FETURES! Such as this console, to mod the games so we will have some reason to SPEND MORE TIME with them. Otherwise, they would end up collecting dust on some shelves. Do you want me to say it in an other way? Or maybe in an other language?

Oh yea, thanks for the heads up!

[Free Flinker]

Originally Posted by Mahtavatar

Hrmph...

I agree with you about these over challenging games that makes you want to throw something at the nearest person passing by, when you still FAIL after 37 tries. I never liked those games. ME thinks games are meant to be entertaining and FUN, not cryptic brainbreakers so to say.

My six year old son is getting into console gaming and already he bitches and moans when he gets to a bit that makes him do it again. Kinda funny but also annoying when it's, "Daddy, get me past this bit!" every 5 minutes. My answer is, "practice yourself or put it away" but he still asks, like me bitching and moaning about it would somehow be preferable

That science thing was just a reference. What I meant was that if you always have such a "conservative" view on things, you never create anything new. It does not mean that if you assume that "something goes without saying" it really does that. I think you see where I am getting here. Let me give you an example: There is this piece of land, let's say an island. No one knows if it is owned by someone. Easily enough, I move in with my troops and occupy it. Even if there is someone living there, this one guy, he is easily disposed of. One can outnumber one by willpower, strength or sheer brutality. The island is mine and the word starts spreading that there is a new government on the island that this one guy used to live on. From there poeple either cope with the situation or not.

The same goes with these unwritten rules. I can say it goes like this! Not the other way! It's word against word. That's the proplem with unwritten rules. AND when I actually get enough people to agree with my point of view, I "write" the new rule, and VOILA! I have created the official rule "cheating is not cheating when no one can see it or when done unofficially". PERIOD.

Anyone can claim power over something, if determined enough.

And again, I never said game development is like democracy. It just resembles it. This was another reference taken to the extreme. No one makes games that the people does not like. THAT would be a waste of resources. Action movies are made because majority like CAR CHASES. Smaller cars are made every day because it has been noted that PEOPLE want smaller cars that do not consume so much gas. LAWS are changed because PEOPLE are going to RIOT if they do not get what they want. PEOPLE rule this world. HUMANS! and humans have will. THE OPINION OF THE MAJORITY COUNTS! I did not say we decide how to build the game, just what we want from our games, and we want MORE FETURES! Such as this console, to mod the games so we will have some reason to SPEND MORE TIME with them. Otherwise, they would end up collecting dust on some shelves. Do you want me to say it in an other way? Or maybe in an other language?

So I'm conservative now, am I? Any chance you can stick to discussing what I say, without embelishing it, especially when you clearly see what you're trying to paint me as in a bad light. Good job I have a thick skin

Like I said, you get to express a preference. The thing is, so do I. Not agreeing with your preference doesn't make me "conservative", an "overgamer", "someone with overgamer traits" or a "hardcore" gamer so it's best you avoid trying to label me.

As for claiming power over what constitutes cheating, sorry but the English language beat you to it. We already have a definition of what cheating is. Using console commands to give you an advantage while playing certainly falls within that definition, despite that your first playthrough may have been cheat-free because it is not relevant. Also, if you use an analogy then don't stack the deck in your own favour. A more correct analogy would be that your island was legally owned by someone so invading it was illegal, period.

You go on to speak of a majority opinion but it has not been established whether your view is in the majority on this. So far, only you have expressed a desire to see a console command able to poke items into the game and while, frankly, I don't care if the next version of this game included such a command or not, I do not agree with you on why it should be so. IMO it would be a complete waste of time and money to invent such a command so the answer is, why bother? So far you have not given a convincing reason to bother. Furthermore, even if you had a majority opinion then the majority must actually express it and then count on a developer to listen. If they do not then you can 'vote with your wallet' and not purchase that game but that's it, so not a democracy at all.

But let's consider how many games include this feature shall we. If it's not most of them then it would seem to indicate that you are wrong and people haven't been voting for it with their wallets. Now I don't have concrete numbers and I don't play every game ever made but my gut is telling me that most games don't have it, the vast majority of those I have played certainly don't. However, since it's your assertion then it is your responsibility to prove it so I don't need to worry about that, not when the onus is on you to back up what you claim is true.

Oh yea, thanks for the heads up!

No problem

[Mahtavatar]

Alright! It seems we are not getting anywhere here, so I'm going to rest my case. Mighty fine stand you put up defending your point of view!

I was NOT trying to paint you in a bad light or label you. Labels are for cans, not for people.

Okay, one day I'll MAKE a game that has everything from consoles to cheat codes! And some hidden GOD ITEMS that you have to use the console AND cheat codes to get. AND you can't beat the game without GETTING those god items!! And I will do that.. just to piss you off!!

Farewell!

[Free Flinker]

LOL though I think such games already exist. They're called console games

I'm betting someone beat me to this suggestion and a game already has it but maybe it'd piss serial cheaters off if the way to access cheatmode on a gamepad was by pressing buttons B, A, B, Y